[xwiki-devs] [Proposal] Technical Spaces + Application Spaces
Hi devs, I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users. 1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users 2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces. In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...". WDYT? Thanks -Vincent PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
+1 Can we please stop hiding "hidden documents" from searches? Right now it adds magic and complexity to admins trying to debug their systems and it could conceivably be a security issue since any user can create and hide a document. The concept of technical spaces sounds like a replacement. Caleb On 08/02/2011 01:05 PM, Vincent Massol wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
+1 for those 2 ideas as well. As discussed IRL earlier today, I also believe that those 2 ideas would benefit XWiki users a lot. Guillaume On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:43 PM, Caleb James DeLisle < calebdelisle@lavabit.com> wrote:
+1
Can we please stop hiding "hidden documents" from searches? Right now it adds magic and complexity to admins trying to debug their systems and it could conceivably be a security issue since any user can create and hide a document. The concept of technical spaces sounds like a replacement.
Caleb
On 08/02/2011 01:05 PM, Vincent Massol wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
Hello, +1 Raluca. On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 8:05 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
Hello On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 7:05 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
+1
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
+1, with this remark : IMO application spaces does not have to be the norm for XWiki applications ; and "Apps Within Minutes" should make it easier to mix application data and unstructured content in pages (so for example you could turn an XWiki page into a meeting easily, there would be meeting scattered across many spaces, and a page that list them all). Jerome.
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
+1 Thanks, Marius On 08/02/2011 08:05 PM, Vincent Massol wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
Hi Vincent, Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ? Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need? Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term... Denis On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO eGuilde sarl - CTO
Hi Denis, On Aug 3, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
Hi Vincent,
Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ?
Here's an example: The Scheduler space: - it's a technical space (i.e. not shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown in the Application Panel for advanced users) A second example: The Blog space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown to all in the Application Panel) Another example: The Sandbox space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's not an application space (i.e. not shown in the Application Panel but shown in the Spaces list in the Dashboard - i.e. in the "Content" spaces list)
Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need?
To do that you'd need two lists for hiding spaces: one for simple users and one for advanced users. That's because both categories of users don't necessarily match in term of needs. I'm fine to have 3 booleans for each space if you think we need to have this use case (i.e. ability to not show spaces for advanced users - I'm still unsure we want to do this though): - is an application space? - is hidden for simple users (replacing technical space idea)? - is hidden for advanced users? What do others think? Do we need the ability to hide spaces for advanced users? Thanks -Vincent
Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term...
Denis
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO eGuilde sarl - CTO _______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 11:39, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis,
On Aug 3, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
Hi Vincent,
Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ?
Here's an example: The Scheduler space: - it's a technical space (i.e. not shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown in the Application Panel for advanced users)
A second example: The Blog space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown to all in the Application Panel)
Another example: The Sandbox space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's not an application space (i.e. not shown in the Application Panel but shown in the Spaces list in the Dashboard - i.e. in the "Content" spaces list)
Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need?
To do that you'd need two lists for hiding spaces: one for simple users and one for advanced users. That's because both categories of users don't necessarily match in term of needs.
I'm fine to have 3 booleans for each space if you think we need to have this use case (i.e. ability to not show spaces for advanced users - I'm still unsure we want to do this though): - is an application space? - is hidden for simple users (replacing technical space idea)? - is hidden for advanced users?
This is going worse IMHO. Finally we needs filtering spaces based on users and "types" of space. Reading this, I am more in favor of "typing" spaces (a single extensible static list), and compute the blacklistedspaces list based on these "types", as well as any other list of spaces you may imagine, like the list of application spaces. For the blacklistedspaces, computing the list in velocity is finally not so bad, and could be adapted depending on your use cases. "Typing" spaces would only helps doing it better. WDYT? Denis
What do others think? Do we need the ability to hide spaces for advanced users?
Thanks -Vincent
Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term...
Denis
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO eGuilde sarl - CTO _______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO eGuilde sarl - CTO
See below On Aug 3, 2011, at 1:08 PM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 11:39, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis,
On Aug 3, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
Hi Vincent,
Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ?
Here's an example: The Scheduler space: - it's a technical space (i.e. not shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown in the Application Panel for advanced users)
A second example: The Blog space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown to all in the Application Panel)
Another example: The Sandbox space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's not an application space (i.e. not shown in the Application Panel but shown in the Spaces list in the Dashboard - i.e. in the "Content" spaces list)
Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need?
To do that you'd need two lists for hiding spaces: one for simple users and one for advanced users. That's because both categories of users don't necessarily match in term of needs.
I'm fine to have 3 booleans for each space if you think we need to have this use case (i.e. ability to not show spaces for advanced users - I'm still unsure we want to do this though): - is an application space? - is hidden for simple users (replacing technical space idea)? - is hidden for advanced users?
This is going worse IMHO. Finally we needs filtering spaces based on users and "types" of space. Reading this, I am more in favor of "typing" spaces (a single extensible static list), and compute the blacklistedspaces list based on these "types", as well as any other list of spaces you may imagine, like the list of application spaces. For the blacklistedspaces, computing the list in velocity is finally not so bad, and could be adapted depending on your use cases. "Typing" spaces would only helps doing it better.
WDYT?
If I understand correctly you're in agreement with all that I've proposed in my initial email except for the implementation part for which you're suggesting to use a single "types" property that would hold all possible space types (rather than having several boolean fields). Something similar to tags basically. I'm very fine with this. I even like it since it's a generalization. It means though that we need to have some "well-known types" on which we can depend. Based on the use cases defined so far we would have 3 possible values: - "technical": only visible for advanced users - "application": listed in the Application Panel (and excluded from the Spaces list in the dashboard) - "hidden": not displayed to anyone including advanced users (we'd need to define more clearly in which screens they'd be hidden and in which others they'd be visible to advanced users though) I'm proposing to start with "technical" and "application" for now. WDYT? Thanks -Vincent
Denis
What do others think? Do we need the ability to hide spaces for advanced users?
Thanks -Vincent
Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term...
Denis
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
Hi, On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 1:21 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
See below
On Aug 3, 2011, at 1:08 PM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 11:39, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis,
On Aug 3, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
Hi Vincent,
Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ?
Here's an example: The Scheduler space: - it's a technical space (i.e. not shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown in the Application Panel for advanced users)
A second example: The Blog space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown to all in the Application Panel)
Another example: The Sandbox space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's not an application space (i.e. not shown in the Application Panel but shown in the Spaces list in the Dashboard - i.e. in the "Content" spaces list)
Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need?
To do that you'd need two lists for hiding spaces: one for simple users and one for advanced users. That's because both categories of users don't necessarily match in term of needs.
I'm fine to have 3 booleans for each space if you think we need to have this use case (i.e. ability to not show spaces for advanced users - I'm still unsure we want to do this though): - is an application space? - is hidden for simple users (replacing technical space idea)? - is hidden for advanced users?
This is going worse IMHO. Finally we needs filtering spaces based on users and "types" of space. Reading this, I am more in favor of "typing" spaces (a single extensible static list), and compute the blacklistedspaces list based on these "types", as well as any other list of spaces you may imagine, like the list of application spaces. For the blacklistedspaces, computing the list in velocity is finally not so bad, and could be adapted depending on your use cases. "Typing" spaces would only helps doing it better.
WDYT?
If I understand correctly you're in agreement with all that I've proposed in my initial email except for the implementation part for which you're suggesting to use a single "types" property that would hold all possible space types (rather than having several boolean fields). Something similar to tags basically.
I'm very fine with this. I even like it since it's a generalization.
It means though that we need to have some "well-known types" on which we can depend. Based on the use cases defined so far we would have 3 possible values: - "technical": only visible for advanced users - "application": listed in the Application Panel (and excluded from the Spaces list in the dashboard) - "hidden": not displayed to anyone including advanced users (we'd need to define more clearly in which screens they'd be hidden and in which others they'd be visible to advanced users though)
I'm proposing to start with "technical" and "application" for now.
Well, 4 types actually, if you also include the normal "content" space type. I'm fine with this solution too since it answers the problem of typing spaces as described above. Guillaume
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
Denis
What do others think? Do we need the ability to hide spaces for advanced users?
Thanks -Vincent
Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term...
Denis
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net>
wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference
for
our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
+1 for the separation. Thanks, Caty On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 15:04, Guillaume Lerouge <guillaume@xwiki.com> wrote:
Hi,
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 1:21 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
See below
On Aug 3, 2011, at 1:08 PM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 11:39, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis,
On Aug 3, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
Hi Vincent,
Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ?
Here's an example: The Scheduler space: - it's a technical space (i.e. not shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown in the Application Panel for advanced users)
A second example: The Blog space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown to all in the Application Panel)
Another example: The Sandbox space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's not an application space (i.e. not shown in the Application Panel but shown in the Spaces list in the Dashboard - i.e. in the "Content" spaces list)
Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need?
To do that you'd need two lists for hiding spaces: one for simple users and one for advanced users. That's because both categories of users don't necessarily match in term of needs.
I'm fine to have 3 booleans for each space if you think we need to have this use case (i.e. ability to not show spaces for advanced users - I'm still unsure we want to do this though): - is an application space? - is hidden for simple users (replacing technical space idea)? - is hidden for advanced users?
This is going worse IMHO. Finally we needs filtering spaces based on users and "types" of space. Reading this, I am more in favor of "typing" spaces (a single extensible static list), and compute the blacklistedspaces list based on these "types", as well as any other list of spaces you may imagine, like the list of application spaces. For the blacklistedspaces, computing the list in velocity is finally not so bad, and could be adapted depending on your use cases. "Typing" spaces would only helps doing it better.
WDYT?
If I understand correctly you're in agreement with all that I've proposed in my initial email except for the implementation part for which you're suggesting to use a single "types" property that would hold all possible space types (rather than having several boolean fields). Something similar to tags basically.
I'm very fine with this. I even like it since it's a generalization.
It means though that we need to have some "well-known types" on which we can depend. Based on the use cases defined so far we would have 3 possible values: - "technical": only visible for advanced users - "application": listed in the Application Panel (and excluded from the Spaces list in the dashboard) - "hidden": not displayed to anyone including advanced users (we'd need to define more clearly in which screens they'd be hidden and in which others they'd be visible to advanced users though)
I'm proposing to start with "technical" and "application" for now.
Well, 4 types actually, if you also include the normal "content" space type.
I'm fine with this solution too since it answers the problem of typing spaces as described above.
Guillaume
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
Denis
What do others think? Do we need the ability to hide spaces for
advanced
users?
Thanks -Vincent
Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term...
Denis
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 13:21, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
See below
On Aug 3, 2011, at 1:08 PM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 11:39, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis,
On Aug 3, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
Hi Vincent,
Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ?
Here's an example: The Scheduler space: - it's a technical space (i.e. not shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown in the Application Panel for advanced users)
A second example: The Blog space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown to all in the Application Panel)
Another example: The Sandbox space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's not an application space (i.e. not shown in the Application Panel but shown in the Spaces list in the Dashboard - i.e. in the "Content" spaces list)
Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need?
To do that you'd need two lists for hiding spaces: one for simple users and one for advanced users. That's because both categories of users don't necessarily match in term of needs.
I'm fine to have 3 booleans for each space if you think we need to have this use case (i.e. ability to not show spaces for advanced users - I'm still unsure we want to do this though): - is an application space? - is hidden for simple users (replacing technical space idea)? - is hidden for advanced users?
This is going worse IMHO. Finally we needs filtering spaces based on users and "types" of space. Reading this, I am more in favor of "typing" spaces (a single extensible static list), and compute the blacklistedspaces list based on these "types", as well as any other list of spaces you may imagine, like the list of application spaces. For the blacklistedspaces, computing the list in velocity is finally not so bad, and could be adapted depending on your use cases. "Typing" spaces would only helps doing it better.
WDYT?
If I understand correctly you're in agreement with all that I've proposed in my initial email except for the implementation part for which you're suggesting to use a single "types" property that would hold all possible space types (rather than having several boolean fields). Something similar to tags basically.
I'm very fine with this. I even like it since it's a generalization.
It means though that we need to have some "well-known types" on which we can depend. Based on the use cases defined so far we would have 3 possible values: - "technical": only visible for advanced users - "application": listed in the Application Panel (and excluded from the Spaces list in the dashboard) - "hidden": not displayed to anyone including advanced users (we'd need to define more clearly in which screens they'd be hidden and in which others they'd be visible to advanced users though)
I'm proposing to start with "technical" and "application" for now.
WDYT?
You get it Vincent, and sorry if my reply have been unclear. For the list, it should stay open, and just fullfil your current needs. I am not sure hidden is a correct typing however, so I would start with 3 "default" (or whatever you like), "technical" and "application". Do not forget in your thought that it would also be nice to filter search results based on these as well. I am +1 for that implementation or something similar and open that do not link filtering and "typing" of spaces. Denis
Thanks -Vincent
Denis
What do others think? Do we need the ability to hide spaces for advanced users?
Thanks -Vincent
Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term...
Denis
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net>
wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference
for
our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO eGuilde sarl - CTO
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Denis Gervalle <dgl@softec.lu> wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 13:21, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
See below
On Aug 3, 2011, at 1:08 PM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 11:39, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis,
On Aug 3, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
Hi Vincent,
Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ?
Here's an example: The Scheduler space: - it's a technical space (i.e. not shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown in the Application Panel for advanced users)
A second example: The Blog space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown to all in the Application Panel)
Another example: The Sandbox space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's not an application space (i.e. not shown in the Application Panel but shown in the Spaces list in the Dashboard - i.e. in the "Content" spaces list)
Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need?
To do that you'd need two lists for hiding spaces: one for simple users and one for advanced users. That's because both categories of users don't necessarily match in term of needs.
I'm fine to have 3 booleans for each space if you think we need to have this use case (i.e. ability to not show spaces for advanced users - I'm still unsure we want to do this though): - is an application space? - is hidden for simple users (replacing technical space idea)? - is hidden for advanced users?
This is going worse IMHO. Finally we needs filtering spaces based on users and "types" of space. Reading this, I am more in favor of "typing" spaces (a single extensible static list), and compute the blacklistedspaces list based on these "types", as well as any other list of spaces you may imagine, like the list of application spaces. For the blacklistedspaces, computing the list in velocity is finally not so bad, and could be adapted depending on your use cases. "Typing" spaces would only helps doing it better.
WDYT?
If I understand correctly you're in agreement with all that I've proposed in my initial email except for the implementation part for which you're suggesting to use a single "types" property that would hold all possible space types (rather than having several boolean fields). Something similar to tags basically.
I'm very fine with this. I even like it since it's a generalization.
It means though that we need to have some "well-known types" on which we can depend. Based on the use cases defined so far we would have 3 possible values: - "technical": only visible for advanced users - "application": listed in the Application Panel (and excluded from the Spaces list in the dashboard) - "hidden": not displayed to anyone including advanced users (we'd need to define more clearly in which screens they'd be hidden and in which others they'd be visible to advanced users though)
I'm proposing to start with "technical" and "application" for now.
WDYT?
You get it Vincent, and sorry if my reply have been unclear. For the list, it should stay open, and just fullfil your current needs. I am not sure hidden is a correct typing however, so I would start with 3 "default" (or whatever you like), "technical" and "application". Do not forget in your thought that it would also be nice to filter search results based on these as well. I am +1 for that implementation or something similar and open that do not link filtering and "typing" of spaces.
+1 for space type concept
Denis
Thanks -Vincent
Denis
What do others think? Do we need the ability to hide spaces for advanced users?
Thanks -Vincent
Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term...
Denis
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net>
wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference
for
our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO eGuilde sarl - CTO _______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Thomas Mortagne
Hello, +1 for typing spaces. Raluca. On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 5:58 PM, Denis Gervalle <dgl@softec.lu> wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 13:21, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
See below
On Aug 3, 2011, at 1:08 PM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
On Wed, Aug 3, 2011 at 11:39, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis,
On Aug 3, 2011, at 11:19 AM, Denis Gervalle wrote:
Hi Vincent,
Why are you proposing 2 booleans ? Is there non-technical application spaces ?
Here's an example: The Scheduler space: - it's a technical space (i.e. not shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown in the Application Panel for advanced users)
A second example: The Blog space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's an application space (i.e. shown to all in the Application Panel)
Another example: The Sandbox space: - it's a non technical space (i.e. shown to all users) - it's not an application space (i.e. not shown in the Application Panel but shown in the Spaces list in the Dashboard - i.e. in the "Content" spaces list)
Maybe a static list for qualifying spaces would be better and more flexible, WDYT ? Or else, why not having a boolean for really hiding spaces, the true replacement of blacklistedspaces (there could be non-technical spaces that admin want to hide anyway) and maybe a static list for qualifying them if you have identified this need?
To do that you'd need two lists for hiding spaces: one for simple users and one for advanced users. That's because both categories of users don't necessarily match in term of needs.
I'm fine to have 3 booleans for each space if you think we need to have this use case (i.e. ability to not show spaces for advanced users - I'm still unsure we want to do this though): - is an application space? - is hidden for simple users (replacing technical space idea)? - is hidden for advanced users?
This is going worse IMHO. Finally we needs filtering spaces based on users and "types" of space. Reading this, I am more in favor of "typing" spaces (a single extensible static list), and compute the blacklistedspaces list based on these "types", as well as any other list of spaces you may imagine, like the list of application spaces. For the blacklistedspaces, computing the list in velocity is finally not so bad, and could be adapted depending on your use cases. "Typing" spaces would only helps doing it better.
WDYT?
If I understand correctly you're in agreement with all that I've proposed in my initial email except for the implementation part for which you're suggesting to use a single "types" property that would hold all possible space types (rather than having several boolean fields). Something similar to tags basically.
I'm very fine with this. I even like it since it's a generalization.
It means though that we need to have some "well-known types" on which we can depend. Based on the use cases defined so far we would have 3 possible values: - "technical": only visible for advanced users - "application": listed in the Application Panel (and excluded from the Spaces list in the dashboard) - "hidden": not displayed to anyone including advanced users (we'd need to define more clearly in which screens they'd be hidden and in which others they'd be visible to advanced users though)
I'm proposing to start with "technical" and "application" for now.
WDYT?
You get it Vincent, and sorry if my reply have been unclear. For the list, it should stay open, and just fullfil your current needs. I am not sure hidden is a correct typing however, so I would start with 3 "default" (or whatever you like), "technical" and "application". Do not forget in your thought that it would also be nice to filter search results based on these as well. I am +1 for that implementation or something similar and open that do not link filtering and "typing" of spaces.
Denis
Thanks -Vincent
Denis
What do others think? Do we need the ability to hide spaces for
advanced
users?
Thanks -Vincent
Your idea seams to me interesting but will probably fall short or be misused on the long term...
Denis
On Tue, Aug 2, 2011 at 19:05, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'd like to propose 2 small changes that should make a huge difference for our users.
1) Introduce the notion of technical spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is a technical space or not. This will allow to: * Remove the blacklistedspaces variable * List only non technical spaces for simple users
2) Introduce the notion of Application spaces
The idea is that in WebPreferences for a space we should have a boolean property mentioning if the space is an application space or not. This will allow to: * Replace the Quick Links Panel with an Applications Panel listing all spaces that are application spaces * Only list Content spaces in the Spaces Gadget in the Dashboard * Add the ability for extensions to declare new applications that automatically appear in the Applications Panel
I'd also like to suggest adding a global admin preferences to quickly select all spaces that are application and/or technical spaces (imagine a list of all spaces with 2 checkboxes for each space listed). This makes it very easy for the admin to reconfigure what are application spaces (thus showing in the app panel) and what spaces should be hidden for simple users. Of course modifying these would modify the WebPreferences of the said spaces.
In addition to make this autodiscoverable I'd suggest that for admins the Application Panel should have a link to this admin feature. Something like "Configure Applications...".
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
PS: I'm very excited about these 2 ideas since they're simple and IMO will make XE much easier to use and understand for people starting to use it.
_______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO eGuilde sarl - CTO _______________________________________________ devs mailing list devs@xwiki.org http://lists.xwiki.org/mailman/listinfo/devs
participants (9)
-
Caleb James DeLisle -
Denis Gervalle -
Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) -
Guillaume Lerouge -
Jerome Velociter -
Marius Dumitru Florea -
Raluca Stavro -
Thomas Mortagne -
Vincent Massol