[xwiki-devs] [PROPOSAL] So, what display name for the new default flavor ?
Hi devs, I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE. Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now. As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)). Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor" "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. WDYT ? -- Thomas Mortagne
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 12:51 PM, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com
wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor"
+1 for Default XWiki Flavor
* "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor.
I really hope that in future we will change our mind (and have the resources) to support more than 1 flavor. Thanks, Caty
I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Thomas Mortagne
On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
A few more ideas: * Classic * Raw * Starter
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Sergiu Dumitriu http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu <sergiu@xwiki.org> wrote:
On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
A few more ideas:
* Classic * Raw * Starter
Not a fan or "Raw". I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. Not sure about "Starter".
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Sergiu Dumitriu http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
-- Thomas Mortagne
I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we might have more than one There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me It has a distinguishable name I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors are non-xwiki ones...) Olivier Sérès
Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> a écrit :
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu <sergiu@xwiki.org> wrote:
On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
A few more ideas:
* Classic * Raw * Starter
Not a fan or "Raw".
I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. Not sure about "Starter".
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Sergiu Dumitriu http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
-- Thomas Mortagne
+1 for Classic 2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>:
I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we might have more than one There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me It has a distinguishable name
I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors are non-xwiki ones...)
Olivier Sérès
Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> a écrit :
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu <sergiu@xwiki.org> wrote:
On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
A few more ideas:
* Classic * Raw * Starter
Not a fan or "Raw".
I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. Not sure about "Starter".
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Sergiu Dumitriu http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:28 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
+1 for Classic
Classic sounds good. +1
2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>:
I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we might have more than one There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me It has a distinguishable name
I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors are non-xwiki ones...)
Olivier Sérès
Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> a écrit :
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu <sergiu@xwiki.org> wrote:
On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
A few more ideas:
* Classic * Raw * Starter
Not a fan or "Raw".
I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. Not sure about "Starter".
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually
see
severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Sergiu Dumitriu http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
Hi, What about "Standard XWiki Flavor"? I think it was mentioned in previous discussions. It`s basically what you get when you download. Once you start customizing or installing some other Flavor, it`s no longer "standard". That and the fact that we used to have, in older versions, a packaging (for the xar or war module, don`t remember) that featured "standard" in it`s name. Thanks, Eduard On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 5:52 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < mariusdumitru.florea@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:28 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
+1 for Classic
Classic sounds good. +1
2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>:
I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we might have more than one There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me It has a distinguishable name
I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors are non-xwiki ones...)
Olivier Sérès
Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com>
a
écrit :
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu <sergiu@xwiki.org>
wrote:
On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
A few more ideas:
* Classic * Raw * Starter
Not a fan or "Raw".
I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. Not sure about "Starter".
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not
going
to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Sergiu Dumitriu http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:27 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
What about "Standard XWiki Flavor"? I think it was mentioned in previous discussions.
It`s basically what you get when you download. Once you start customizing or installing some other Flavor, it`s no longer "standard".
Note exactly. When you download XWiki you don't have any Flavor installed, you choose the classic/standard one among several others (ok maybe not several right now :)), it's just the first one listed.
That and the fact that we used to have, in older versions, a packaging (for the xar or war module, don`t remember) that featured "standard" in it`s name.
Thanks, Eduard
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 5:52 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < mariusdumitru.florea@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:28 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
+1 for Classic
Classic sounds good. +1
2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>:
I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we might have more than one There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me It has a distinguishable name
I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors are non-xwiki ones...)
Olivier Sérès
Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com>
a
écrit :
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu <sergiu@xwiki.org>
wrote:
> On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: > Hi devs, > > I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform > flavor which is going to replace XE. > > Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now. > > As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied > to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" > :)). > > Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: > * "XWiki Flavor" > * "Default XWiki Flavor" > * "Generic XWiki Flavor" > * "Base XWiki Flavor"
A few more ideas:
* Classic * Raw * Starter
Not a fan or "Raw".
I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. Not sure about "Starter".
> "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. > > "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. > Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's > fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed > extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. > > Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not
going
> to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see > severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than > "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the > XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also > fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. > > WDYT ? >
-- Sergiu Dumitriu http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Thomas Mortagne
When you download the war, you have no UI. At that point, I guess you will be proposed to install the default UI associated to your war (which, in this case, will be one and the same with the "Standard XWiki Flavor") OR choose from a list of available Flavors. In this case, I guess that "Standard XWiki Flavor" will not be listed in the flavors list, to avoid duplication. If I got things right, then it sounds good to me to see the first option (i.e. featured) to be the "standard" and, below it, various alternatives for various/specialized use cases. Thanks, Eduard On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 1:36 PM, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:27 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
What about "Standard XWiki Flavor"? I think it was mentioned in previous discussions.
It`s basically what you get when you download. Once you start customizing or installing some other Flavor, it`s no longer "standard".
Note exactly. When you download XWiki you don't have any Flavor installed, you choose the classic/standard one among several others (ok maybe not several right now :)), it's just the first one listed.
That and the fact that we used to have, in older versions, a packaging
(for
the xar or war module, don`t remember) that featured "standard" in it`s name.
Thanks, Eduard
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 5:52 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < mariusdumitru.florea@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:28 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
+1 for Classic
Classic sounds good. +1
2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>:
I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we might have more than one There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me It has a distinguishable name
I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors
are
non-xwiki ones...)
Olivier Sérès
Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> a écrit :
> On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu < sergiu@xwiki.org> wrote: >> On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: >> Hi devs, >> >> I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform >> flavor which is going to replace XE. >> >> Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now. >> >> As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied >> to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" >> :)). >> >> Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: >> * "XWiki Flavor" >> * "Default XWiki Flavor" >> * "Generic XWiki Flavor" >> * "Base XWiki Flavor" > > A few more ideas: > > * Classic > * Raw > * Starter
Not a fan or "Raw".
I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. Not sure about "Starter".
> >> "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. >> >> "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. >> Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's >> fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed >> extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. >> >> Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going >> to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see >> severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than >> "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the >> XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also >> fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. >> >> WDYT ? >> > > > -- > Sergiu Dumitriu > http://purl.org/net/sergiu/
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Thomas Mortagne
No there is no default UI in this distribution, just flavors. As I said in the previous mail you will have a flavor picker in which you will see the classic one and the others. Of course other distributions of XWiki may still have default UI and don't let you choose a flavor like XE does. On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
When you download the war, you have no UI. At that point, I guess you will be proposed to install the default UI associated to your war (which, in this case, will be one and the same with the "Standard XWiki Flavor") OR choose from a list of available Flavors. In this case, I guess that "Standard XWiki Flavor" will not be listed in the flavors list, to avoid duplication.
If I got things right, then it sounds good to me to see the first option (i.e. featured) to be the "standard" and, below it, various alternatives for various/specialized use cases.
Thanks, Eduard
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 1:36 PM, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:27 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
What about "Standard XWiki Flavor"? I think it was mentioned in previous discussions.
It`s basically what you get when you download. Once you start customizing or installing some other Flavor, it`s no longer "standard".
Note exactly. When you download XWiki you don't have any Flavor installed, you choose the classic/standard one among several others (ok maybe not several right now :)), it's just the first one listed.
That and the fact that we used to have, in older versions, a packaging
(for
the xar or war module, don`t remember) that featured "standard" in it`s name.
Thanks, Eduard
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 5:52 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < mariusdumitru.florea@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:28 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
+1 for Classic
Classic sounds good. +1
2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>:
I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we might have more than one There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me It has a distinguishable name
I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors
are
non-xwiki ones...)
Olivier Sérès
> Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> a écrit : > >> On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu < sergiu@xwiki.org> wrote: >>> On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: >>> Hi devs, >>> >>> I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform >>> flavor which is going to replace XE. >>> >>> Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now. >>> >>> As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied >>> to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" >>> :)). >>> >>> Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: >>> * "XWiki Flavor" >>> * "Default XWiki Flavor" >>> * "Generic XWiki Flavor" >>> * "Base XWiki Flavor" >> >> A few more ideas: >> >> * Classic >> * Raw >> * Starter > > Not a fan or "Raw". > > I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. > Not sure about "Starter". > >> >>> "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. >>> >>> "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. >>> Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's >>> fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed >>> extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. >>> >>> Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going >>> to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see >>> severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than >>> "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the >>> XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also >>> fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. >>> >>> WDYT ? >>> >> >> >> -- >> Sergiu Dumitriu >> http://purl.org/net/sergiu/ > > > > -- > Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 2:55 PM, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
No there is no default UI in this distribution, just flavors.
As I said in the previous mail you will have a flavor picker in which you will see the classic one and the others.
Of course other distributions of XWiki may still have default UI and don't let you choose a flavor like XE does.
I feel we`re having a bit of duplication here between the "default UI" and the "Flavor" steps. AFAICT, they do pretty much the same thing and should ideally be merged. Basically, the default UI mechanism should indicate the recommended flavor/ui (if any) for the war you have, but should also not enforce it, allowing you to go with whatever flavor you like. There's really no point in separating the 2 and I guess we are here because they were developed in separate efforts. Anyway, back to the original question of the thread, I reiterate my +1 for "Standard" (I'm not a fan of "classic", which I find awkward and a bit old-fashion/outdated :), specially if you consider people new to XWiki). Thanks, Eduard
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
When you download the war, you have no UI. At that point, I guess you will be proposed to install the default UI associated to your war (which, in this case, will be one and the same with the "Standard XWiki Flavor") OR choose from a list of available Flavors. In this case, I guess that "Standard XWiki Flavor" will not be listed in the flavors list, to avoid duplication.
If I got things right, then it sounds good to me to see the first option (i.e. featured) to be the "standard" and, below it, various alternatives for various/specialized use cases.
Thanks, Eduard
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 1:36 PM, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:27 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
What about "Standard XWiki Flavor"? I think it was mentioned in previous discussions.
It`s basically what you get when you download. Once you start customizing or installing some other Flavor, it`s no longer "standard".
Note exactly. When you download XWiki you don't have any Flavor installed, you choose the classic/standard one among several others (ok maybe not several right now :)), it's just the first one listed.
That and the fact that we used to have, in older versions, a packaging
(for
the xar or war module, don`t remember) that featured "standard" in it`s name.
Thanks, Eduard
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 5:52 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < mariusdumitru.florea@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:28 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
+1 for Classic
Classic sounds good. +1
2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>:
> I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : > For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor,
now we
might > have more than one > There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me > It has a distinguishable name > > I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors are > non-xwiki ones...) > > Olivier Sérès > > > Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> a > écrit : > > > >> On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu < sergiu@xwiki.org> > wrote: > >>> On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: > >>> Hi devs, > >>> > >>> I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform > >>> flavor which is going to replace XE. > >>> > >>> Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed > XWiki now. > >>> > >>> As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied > >>> to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" > >>> :)). > >>> > >>> Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: > >>> * "XWiki Flavor" > >>> * "Default XWiki Flavor" > >>> * "Generic XWiki Flavor" > >>> * "Base XWiki Flavor" > >> > >> A few more ideas: > >> > >> * Classic > >> * Raw > >> * Starter > > > > Not a fan or "Raw". > > > > I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. > > Not sure about "Starter". > > > >> > >>> "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. > >>> > >>> "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. > >>> Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's > >>> fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed > >>> extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. > >>> > >>> Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going > >>> to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see > >>> severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than > >>> "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the > >>> XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also > >>> fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. > >>> > >>> WDYT ? > >>> > >> > >> > >> -- > >> Sergiu Dumitriu > >> http://purl.org/net/sergiu/ > > > > > > > > -- > > Thomas Mortagne >
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
I'm not keen on the "Standard" terminology because it can make people think other flavors (such as Knowleged Flavor) are not standard which could be seen as pejorative. "Classic" does not imply being better or worse and describes what this flavor really is: the "classical" version of XWiki that we have distributed for years. Which also means: not specialized for a special use-case. Thanks, Guillaume 2017-05-26 14:59 GMT+02:00 Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com>:
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 2:55 PM, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
No there is no default UI in this distribution, just flavors.
As I said in the previous mail you will have a flavor picker in which you will see the classic one and the others.
Of course other distributions of XWiki may still have default UI and don't let you choose a flavor like XE does.
I feel we`re having a bit of duplication here between the "default UI" and the "Flavor" steps. AFAICT, they do pretty much the same thing and should ideally be merged. Basically, the default UI mechanism should indicate the recommended flavor/ui (if any) for the war you have, but should also not enforce it, allowing you to go with whatever flavor you like. There's really no point in separating the 2 and I guess we are here because they were developed in separate efforts.
Anyway, back to the original question of the thread, I reiterate my +1 for "Standard" (I'm not a fan of "classic", which I find awkward and a bit old-fashion/outdated :), specially if you consider people new to XWiki).
Thanks, Eduard
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
When you download the war, you have no UI. At that point, I guess you will be proposed to install the default UI associated to your war (which, in this case, will be one and the same with the "Standard XWiki Flavor")
OR
choose from a list of available Flavors. In this case, I guess that "Standard XWiki Flavor" will not be listed in the flavors list, to avoid duplication.
If I got things right, then it sounds good to me to see the first option (i.e. featured) to be the "standard" and, below it, various alternatives for various/specialized use cases.
Thanks, Eduard
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 1:36 PM, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:27 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com
wrote:
Hi,
What about "Standard XWiki Flavor"? I think it was mentioned in previous discussions.
It`s basically what you get when you download. Once you start customizing or installing some other Flavor, it`s no longer "standard".
Note exactly. When you download XWiki you don't have any Flavor installed, you choose the classic/standard one among several others (ok maybe not several right now :)), it's just the first one listed.
That and the fact that we used to have, in older versions, a
packaging (for
the xar or war module, don`t remember) that featured "standard" in it`s name.
Thanks, Eduard
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 5:52 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < mariusdumitru.florea@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:28 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
> +1 for Classic >
Classic sounds good. +1
> > 2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>: > > > I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : > > For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we > might > > have more than one > > There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me > > It has a distinguishable name > > > > I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors are > > non-xwiki ones...) > > > > Olivier Sérès > > > > > Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> a > > écrit : > > > > > >> On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu < sergiu@xwiki.org> > > wrote: > > >>> On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: > > >>> Hi devs, > > >>> > > >>> I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform > > >>> flavor which is going to replace XE. > > >>> > > >>> Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed > > XWiki now. > > >>> > > >>> As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not > tied > > >>> to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" > > >>> :)). > > >>> > > >>> Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: > > >>> * "XWiki Flavor" > > >>> * "Default XWiki Flavor" > > >>> * "Generic XWiki Flavor" > > >>> * "Base XWiki Flavor" > > >> > > >> A few more ideas: > > >> > > >> * Classic > > >> * Raw > > >> * Starter > > > > > > Not a fan or "Raw". > > > > > > I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. > > > Not sure about "Starter". > > > > > >> > > >>> "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. > > >>> > > >>> "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. > > >>> Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's > > >>> fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed > > >>> extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. > > >>> > > >>> Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going > > >>> to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually > see > > >>> severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than > > >>> "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the > > >>> XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm > also > > >>> fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. > > >>> > > >>> WDYT ? > > >>> > > >> > > >> > > >> -- > > >> Sergiu Dumitriu > > >> http://purl.org/net/sergiu/ > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Thomas Mortagne > > > > > > -- > Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) > Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS > Committer on the XWiki.org project >
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
"Standard" -> Current, generalist, non-specialized, all-round solution, good for everybody to use or to start with * https://www.google.ro/search?q=define+standard * http://www.dictionary.com/browse/standard "Classic" -> Old, legacy, historical, proven reliable by time, etc. (when comparing to the modern, current version); generally implies "old", in one way or another * https://www.google.ro/search?q=define+classic * http://www.dictionary.com/browse/classic You usually have this in software when you have 2 versions: current/modern one (standard) and the older one (classic). IMO, "classic", by itself, does not make sense (i.e. when you don`t have a "standard" to compare with) and it would be sending the wrong message. Also, everything we do (developing, manual and automated testing, roadmap, etc.) is around this flavor, so it is the "standard" to which we relate. I also have nothing against "Generic" or "Default" (i.e. +0) which focus more on the functional objective of the flavor, but they get a bit technical by going into these details, so that`s why I felt "Standard" was abstract enough and also clear enough in sending the right message, which is "Pick me if you don`t know what you want". P.S.: "classic" bikeshedding :) (but I guess it's OK on this type of thread :) ) Thanks, Eduard On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 5:20 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
I'm not keen on the "Standard" terminology because it can make people think other flavors (such as Knowleged Flavor) are not standard which could be seen as pejorative.
"Classic" does not imply being better or worse and describes what this flavor really is: the "classical" version of XWiki that we have distributed for years. Which also means: not specialized for a special use-case.
Thanks,
Guillaume
2017-05-26 14:59 GMT+02:00 Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com>:
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 2:55 PM, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
No there is no default UI in this distribution, just flavors.
As I said in the previous mail you will have a flavor picker in which you will see the classic one and the others.
Of course other distributions of XWiki may still have default UI and don't let you choose a flavor like XE does.
I feel we`re having a bit of duplication here between the "default UI" and the "Flavor" steps. AFAICT, they do pretty much the same thing and should ideally be merged. Basically, the default UI mechanism should indicate the recommended flavor/ui (if any) for the war you have, but should also not enforce it, allowing you to go with whatever flavor you like. There's really no point in separating the 2 and I guess we are here because they were developed in separate efforts.
Anyway, back to the original question of the thread, I reiterate my +1 for "Standard" (I'm not a fan of "classic", which I find awkward and a bit old-fashion/outdated :), specially if you consider people new to XWiki).
Thanks, Eduard
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:50 PM, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
When you download the war, you have no UI. At that point, I guess you will be proposed to install the default UI associated to your war (which,
in
this case, will be one and the same with the "Standard XWiki Flavor") OR choose from a list of available Flavors. In this case, I guess that "Standard XWiki Flavor" will not be listed in the flavors list, to avoid duplication.
If I got things right, then it sounds good to me to see the first option (i.e. featured) to be the "standard" and, below it, various alternatives for various/specialized use cases.
Thanks, Eduard
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 1:36 PM, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
On Fri, May 26, 2017 at 12:27 PM, Eduard Moraru < enygma2002@gmail.com
wrote:
Hi,
What about "Standard XWiki Flavor"? I think it was mentioned in previous discussions.
It`s basically what you get when you download. Once you start customizing or installing some other Flavor, it`s no longer "standard".
Note exactly. When you download XWiki you don't have any Flavor installed, you choose the classic/standard one among several others (ok maybe not several right now :)), it's just the first one listed.
That and the fact that we used to have, in older versions, a
packaging (for
the xar or war module, don`t remember) that featured "standard" in it`s name.
Thanks, Eduard
On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 5:52 PM, Marius Dumitru Florea < mariusdumitru.florea@xwiki.com> wrote:
> On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 3:28 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < > guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote: > > > +1 for Classic > > > > Classic sounds good. +1 > > > > > > 2017-05-24 14:16 GMT+02:00 Olivier Seres <oseres@xwiki.com>: > > > > > I m also in flavor of Classic Flavor for 3 reasons : > > > For the last 10 years, it was THE (only one) proposed flavor, now we > > might > > > have more than one > > > There is "Class" in classic , sound positive to me > > > It has a distinguishable name > > > > > > I find "xwiki flavour" confusing ( it implies that other flavors are > > > non-xwiki ones...) > > > > > > Olivier Sérès > > > > > > > Le 24 mai 2017 à 14:03, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> > a > > > écrit : > > > > > > > >> On Wed, May 24, 2017 at 1:44 PM, Sergiu Dumitriu < sergiu@xwiki.org> > > > wrote: > > > >>> On 05/24/2017 05:51 AM, Thomas Mortagne wrote: > > > >>> Hi devs, > > > >>> > > > >>> I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform > > > >>> flavor which is going to replace XE. > > > >>> > > > >>> Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when > installed > > > XWiki now. > > > >>> > > > >>> As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not > > tied > > > >>> to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" > > > >>> :)). > > > >>> > > > >>> Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: > > > >>> * "XWiki Flavor" > > > >>> * "Default XWiki Flavor" > > > >>> * "Generic XWiki Flavor" > > > >>> * "Base XWiki Flavor" > > > >> > > > >> A few more ideas: > > > >> > > > >> * Classic > > > >> * Raw > > > >> * Starter > > > > > > > > Not a fan or "Raw". > > > > > > > > I like "Classic", might sound better than "Default" for most users. > > > > Not sure about "Starter". > > > > > > > >> > > > >>> "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. > > > >>> > > > >>> "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. > > > >>> Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's > > > >>> fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed > > > >>> extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. > > > >>> > > > >>> Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not > going > > > >>> to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually > > see > > > >>> severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than > > > >>> "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since > the > > > >>> XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm > > also > > > >>> fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. > > > >>> > > > >>> WDYT ? > > > >>> > > > >> > > > >> > > > >> -- > > > >> Sergiu Dumitriu > > > >> http://purl.org/net/sergiu/ > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Thomas Mortagne > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) > > Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS > > Committer on the XWiki.org project > > >
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV: * "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib. Thanks -Vincent
On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Thomas Mortagne
So here is the current situation = Proposition which don't annoy people enough to get a veto * "Default XWiki Flavor" (+3) * "Standard XWiki Flavor" (+2) = Someone gave a veto on those * "Base XWiki Flavor" * "Classic XWiki Flavor" (good success for this one until it hits Edy and Vincent) * "Raw XWiki Flavor" * "Starter XWiki Flavor" * "XWiki Flavor” * "Generic XWiki Flavor" Anyone want to change his votes ? I don't really have a preference between "Default" and "Standard". On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV:
* "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib.
Thanks -Vincent
On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
Hi All, Sorry to jump in after an already long discussion since we are getting close to a conclusion, so I just don’t want my intervention to cause more fuzz than good. I am in accordance with most of what was said so far, but “Default” looks to me a less valuable naming than “Standard”, it is not a strong opinion, so I give my +1 to “Standard” and +0 to “Default”. I will use “Standard" in the following, just to be clearer, but you can substitute it with “Default” if you wish (you might notice further subtle differences, or not). So, what I am not sure about now is why all proposals end with “XWiki flavor” (and this is not really about the American spelling of flavour ! :D). All flavours we gonna have surely will be XWiki ones, won’t it ? So if we start with the “Standard XWiki Flavor”, I am afraid we are going to lead a movement where everyone will name their flavour with that same suffix. Is that our intention ? “XWiki Standard Flavor” would already carry a different meaning, since it would say more “Standard flavour made by the XWiki team”. However, if our intent was more to say this is a generic wiki flavour, using “Standard Wiki Flavor” looks more in line with our intended meaning. And if our meaning is more that this is just a generic flavour, ending with “Standard Flavor” is probably simpler, clearer and better. WDYT ? -- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 16:48, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote: So here is the current situation = Proposition which don't annoy people enough to get a veto * "Default XWiki Flavor" (+3) * "Standard XWiki Flavor" (+2) = Someone gave a veto on those * "Base XWiki Flavor" * "Classic XWiki Flavor" (good success for this one until it hits Edy and Vincent) * "Raw XWiki Flavor" * "Starter XWiki Flavor" * "XWiki Flavor” * "Generic XWiki Flavor" Anyone want to change his votes ? I don't really have a preference between "Default" and "Standard". On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV:
* "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib.
Thanks -Vincent
On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
Hi Denis and all,
On 10 Jun 2017, at 11:46, Denis Gervalle <dgl@softec.lu> wrote:
Hi All, Sorry to jump in after an already long discussion since we are getting close to a conclusion, so I just don’t want my intervention to cause more fuzz than good. I am in accordance with most of what was said so far, but “Default” looks to me a less valuable naming than “Standard”, it is not a strong opinion, so I give my +1 to “Standard” and +0 to “Default”. I will use “Standard" in the following, just to be clearer, but you can substitute it with “Default” if you wish (you might notice further subtle differences, or not). So, what I am not sure about now is why all proposals end with “XWiki flavor” (and this is not really about the American spelling of flavour ! :D). All flavours we gonna have surely will be XWiki ones, won’t it ? So if we start with the “Standard XWiki Flavor”, I am afraid we are going to lead a movement where everyone will name their flavour with that same suffix. Is that our intention ? “XWiki Standard Flavor” would already carry a different meaning, since it would say more “Standard flavour made by the XWiki team”. However, if our intent was more to say this is a generic wiki flavour, using “Standard Wiki Flavor” looks more in line with our intended meaning. And if our meaning is more that this is just a generic flavour, ending with “Standard Flavor” is probably simpler, clearer and better. WDYT ?
I agree with you. I think we have 2 choices for the name that appears in the DW UI: * “Standard”. We may not even need the “Flavor” suffix in the same way as we don’t add an “Extension” suffix in the EM UI. IMO the DW UI for flavors should indicate the author in the UI, something like ”Standard” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team” or “developed by XWiki SAS” or “developed by Denis Gervalle”. * "XWiki Standard” or “XWiki Standard Flavor” to indicate it’s the one made by the XWiki open source dev team. So that could be the full name but the name we display in the DW UI could simply be “Standard Flavor” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team”, etc. If we want to use the term “Wiki” then it could come as a replacement for the “Standard” term, to mention that it’s a generic wiki flavor, as opposed to an intranet flavor, a knowledge base flavor, etc. But I agree that “Wiki Flavor” is a good contender (and one that Ludovic mentioned too, he even mentioned Structured Wiki Flavor). I’d be +0 on “Wiki Flavor”. “Standard Wiki Flavor” is also possible and hints that there can be other generic Wiki flavors that are not standard. So I’m also +0 for it. Now outside of the DW UI, the full name of the flavors done by the XWiki Dev Team could be prefixed with XWiki as in “the XWiki Standard Flavor” (or “XWiki Demo Flavor”). Other companies or individuals would name is with their identity, such as “the <my company> Procedure Flavor”. WDYT? Thanks -Vincent
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 16:48, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote: So here is the current situation
= Proposition which don't annoy people enough to get a veto
* "Default XWiki Flavor" (+3) * "Standard XWiki Flavor" (+2)
= Someone gave a veto on those
* "Base XWiki Flavor" * "Classic XWiki Flavor" (good success for this one until it hits Edy and Vincent) * "Raw XWiki Flavor" * "Starter XWiki Flavor" * "XWiki Flavor” * "Generic XWiki Flavor"
Anyone want to change his votes ?
I don't really have a preference between "Default" and "Standard".
On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV:
* "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib.
Thanks -Vincent
On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
Hi, I'm jumping in a bit late, but I was just wondering if anyone considered "Vanilla" [1]. It was the absolute first thing that popped to my mind when I saw the discussion about naming the standard flavour. Just my 2 cents, Marta [1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla_software On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 7:07 AM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis and all,
On 10 Jun 2017, at 11:46, Denis Gervalle <dgl@softec.lu> wrote:
Hi All, Sorry to jump in after an already long discussion since we are getting close to a conclusion, so I just don’t want my intervention to cause more fuzz than good. I am in accordance with most of what was said so far, but “Default” looks to me a less valuable naming than “Standard”, it is not a strong opinion, so I give my +1 to “Standard” and +0 to “Default”. I will use “Standard" in the following, just to be clearer, but you can substitute it with “Default” if you wish (you might notice further subtle differences, or not). So, what I am not sure about now is why all proposals end with “XWiki flavor” (and this is not really about the American spelling of flavour ! :D). All flavours we gonna have surely will be XWiki ones, won’t it ? So if we start with the “Standard XWiki Flavor”, I am afraid we are going to lead a movement where everyone will name their flavour with that same suffix. Is that our intention ? “XWiki Standard Flavor” would already carry a different meaning, since it would say more “Standard flavour made by the XWiki team”. However, if our intent was more to say this is a generic wiki flavour, using “Standard Wiki Flavor” looks more in line with our intended meaning. And if our meaning is more that this is just a generic flavour, ending with “Standard Flavor” is probably simpler, clearer and better. WDYT ?
I agree with you.
I think we have 2 choices for the name that appears in the DW UI: * “Standard”. We may not even need the “Flavor” suffix in the same way as we don’t add an “Extension” suffix in the EM UI. IMO the DW UI for flavors should indicate the author in the UI, something like ”Standard” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team” or “developed by XWiki SAS” or “developed by Denis Gervalle”. * "XWiki Standard” or “XWiki Standard Flavor” to indicate it’s the one made by the XWiki open source dev team. So that could be the full name but the name we display in the DW UI could simply be “Standard Flavor” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team”, etc.
If we want to use the term “Wiki” then it could come as a replacement for the “Standard” term, to mention that it’s a generic wiki flavor, as opposed to an intranet flavor, a knowledge base flavor, etc. But I agree that “Wiki Flavor” is a good contender (and one that Ludovic mentioned too, he even mentioned Structured Wiki Flavor). I’d be +0 on “Wiki Flavor”. “Standard Wiki Flavor” is also possible and hints that there can be other generic Wiki flavors that are not standard. So I’m also +0 for it.
Now outside of the DW UI, the full name of the flavors done by the XWiki Dev Team could be prefixed with XWiki as in “the XWiki Standard Flavor” (or “XWiki Demo Flavor”). Other companies or individuals would name is with their identity, such as “the <my company> Procedure Flavor”.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 16:48, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote: So here is the current situation
= Proposition which don't annoy people enough to get a veto
* "Default XWiki Flavor" (+3) * "Standard XWiki Flavor" (+2)
= Someone gave a veto on those
* "Base XWiki Flavor" * "Classic XWiki Flavor" (good success for this one until it hits Edy and Vincent) * "Raw XWiki Flavor" * "Starter XWiki Flavor" * "XWiki Flavor” * "Generic XWiki Flavor"
Anyone want to change his votes ?
I don't really have a preference between "Default" and "Standard".
On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV:
* "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib.
Thanks -Vincent
On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
"XWiki Vanilla", because it`s the *standard flavor* :D Sounds so funny that I kind of like it :) However, I`m not so sure about non-techinical users or how that goes with other stuff that we already or might produce, since we don`t really have a pattern on that. Fun proposal, though. Thanks, Eduard On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 8:07 PM, Marta Girdea <marta.girdea@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
I'm jumping in a bit late, but I was just wondering if anyone considered "Vanilla" [1]. It was the absolute first thing that popped to my mind when I saw the discussion about naming the standard flavour.
Just my 2 cents, Marta
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla_software
On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 7:07 AM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis and all,
On 10 Jun 2017, at 11:46, Denis Gervalle <dgl@softec.lu> wrote:
Hi All, Sorry to jump in after an already long discussion since we are getting close to a conclusion, so I just don’t want my intervention to cause more fuzz than good. I am in accordance with most of what was said so far, but “Default” looks to me a less valuable naming than “Standard”, it is not a strong opinion, so I give my +1 to “Standard” and +0 to “Default”. I will use “Standard" in the following, just to be clearer, but you can substitute it with “Default” if you wish (you might notice further subtle differences, or not). So, what I am not sure about now is why all proposals end with “XWiki flavor” (and this is not really about the American spelling of flavour ! :D). All flavours we gonna have surely will be XWiki ones, won’t it ? So if we start with the “Standard XWiki Flavor”, I am afraid we are going to lead a movement where everyone will name their flavour with that same suffix. Is that our intention ? “XWiki Standard Flavor” would already carry a different meaning, since it would say more “Standard flavour made by the XWiki team”. However, if our intent was more to say this is a generic wiki flavour, using “Standard Wiki Flavor” looks more in line with our intended meaning. And if our meaning is more that this is just a generic flavour, ending with “Standard Flavor” is probably simpler, clearer and better. WDYT ?
I agree with you.
I think we have 2 choices for the name that appears in the DW UI: * “Standard”. We may not even need the “Flavor” suffix in the same way as we don’t add an “Extension” suffix in the EM UI. IMO the DW UI for flavors should indicate the author in the UI, something like ”Standard” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team” or “developed by XWiki SAS” or “developed by Denis Gervalle”. * "XWiki Standard” or “XWiki Standard Flavor” to indicate it’s the one made by the XWiki open source dev team. So that could be the full name but the name we display in the DW UI could simply be “Standard Flavor” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team”, etc.
If we want to use the term “Wiki” then it could come as a replacement for the “Standard” term, to mention that it’s a generic wiki flavor, as opposed to an intranet flavor, a knowledge base flavor, etc. But I agree that “Wiki Flavor” is a good contender (and one that Ludovic mentioned too, he even mentioned Structured Wiki Flavor). I’d be +0 on “Wiki Flavor”. “Standard Wiki Flavor” is also possible and hints that there can be other generic Wiki flavors that are not standard. So I’m also +0 for it.
Now outside of the DW UI, the full name of the flavors done by the XWiki Dev Team could be prefixed with XWiki as in “the XWiki Standard Flavor” (or “XWiki Demo Flavor”). Other companies or individuals would name is with their identity, such as “the <my company> Procedure Flavor”.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 16:48, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote: So here is the current situation
= Proposition which don't annoy people enough to get a veto
* "Default XWiki Flavor" (+3) * "Standard XWiki Flavor" (+2)
= Someone gave a veto on those
* "Base XWiki Flavor" * "Classic XWiki Flavor" (good success for this one until it hits Edy and Vincent) * "Raw XWiki Flavor" * "Starter XWiki Flavor" * "XWiki Flavor” * "Generic XWiki Flavor"
Anyone want to change his votes ?
I don't really have a preference between "Default" and "Standard".
On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV:
* "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib.
Thanks -Vincent
On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com
wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed
XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not
tied
to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
On 12 Jun 2017, at 12:42, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
"XWiki Vanilla", because it`s the *standard flavor* :D Sounds so funny that I kind of like it :)
However, I`m not so sure about non-techinical users or how that goes with other stuff that we already or might produce, since we don`t really have a pattern on that. Fun proposal, though.
My POV: * The wikipedia page on “Vanilla” shows that the name is perfect from a technical POV. It really represents what we want. * I think most of our users are non-tech and wouldn’t understand it since I don’t think the “Vanilla” terminology is that common outside of tech circles So I agree that it’s a fun proposal but we’ll get users asking us frequently why we chose an ice-cream flavor for an XWiki flavor ;) Thus I’m also hesitating but I think I’m more -0 since “XWiki Vanilla" sounds more like a code name than a real name. I think that I still prefer “Standard” or “Default” ATM (with a small preference for “Standard” which has a bit more meaning than “Default” for me). Now if everyone else prefers “Vanilla”, I wouldn’t oppose it, as I also find it fun and to the point. Thanks -Vincent
Thanks, Eduard
On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 8:07 PM, Marta Girdea <marta.girdea@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
I'm jumping in a bit late, but I was just wondering if anyone considered "Vanilla" [1]. It was the absolute first thing that popped to my mind when I saw the discussion about naming the standard flavour.
Just my 2 cents, Marta
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla_software
On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 7:07 AM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis and all,
On 10 Jun 2017, at 11:46, Denis Gervalle <dgl@softec.lu> wrote:
Hi All, Sorry to jump in after an already long discussion since we are getting close to a conclusion, so I just don’t want my intervention to cause more fuzz than good. I am in accordance with most of what was said so far, but “Default” looks to me a less valuable naming than “Standard”, it is not a strong opinion, so I give my +1 to “Standard” and +0 to “Default”. I will use “Standard" in the following, just to be clearer, but you can substitute it with “Default” if you wish (you might notice further subtle differences, or not). So, what I am not sure about now is why all proposals end with “XWiki flavor” (and this is not really about the American spelling of flavour ! :D). All flavours we gonna have surely will be XWiki ones, won’t it ? So if we start with the “Standard XWiki Flavor”, I am afraid we are going to lead a movement where everyone will name their flavour with that same suffix. Is that our intention ? “XWiki Standard Flavor” would already carry a different meaning, since it would say more “Standard flavour made by the XWiki team”. However, if our intent was more to say this is a generic wiki flavour, using “Standard Wiki Flavor” looks more in line with our intended meaning. And if our meaning is more that this is just a generic flavour, ending with “Standard Flavor” is probably simpler, clearer and better. WDYT ?
I agree with you.
I think we have 2 choices for the name that appears in the DW UI: * “Standard”. We may not even need the “Flavor” suffix in the same way as we don’t add an “Extension” suffix in the EM UI. IMO the DW UI for flavors should indicate the author in the UI, something like ”Standard” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team” or “developed by XWiki SAS” or “developed by Denis Gervalle”. * "XWiki Standard” or “XWiki Standard Flavor” to indicate it’s the one made by the XWiki open source dev team. So that could be the full name but the name we display in the DW UI could simply be “Standard Flavor” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team”, etc.
If we want to use the term “Wiki” then it could come as a replacement for the “Standard” term, to mention that it’s a generic wiki flavor, as opposed to an intranet flavor, a knowledge base flavor, etc. But I agree that “Wiki Flavor” is a good contender (and one that Ludovic mentioned too, he even mentioned Structured Wiki Flavor). I’d be +0 on “Wiki Flavor”. “Standard Wiki Flavor” is also possible and hints that there can be other generic Wiki flavors that are not standard. So I’m also +0 for it.
Now outside of the DW UI, the full name of the flavors done by the XWiki Dev Team could be prefixed with XWiki as in “the XWiki Standard Flavor” (or “XWiki Demo Flavor”). Other companies or individuals would name is with their identity, such as “the <my company> Procedure Flavor”.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 16:48, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote: So here is the current situation
= Proposition which don't annoy people enough to get a veto
* "Default XWiki Flavor" (+3) * "Standard XWiki Flavor" (+2)
= Someone gave a veto on those
* "Base XWiki Flavor" * "Classic XWiki Flavor" (good success for this one until it hits Edy and Vincent) * "Raw XWiki Flavor" * "Starter XWiki Flavor" * "XWiki Flavor” * "Generic XWiki Flavor"
Anyone want to change his votes ?
I don't really have a preference between "Default" and "Standard".
On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV:
* "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib.
Thanks -Vincent
On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne <thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com
wrote:
Hi devs,
I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform flavor which is going to replace XE.
Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed
XWiki now.
As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not
tied
to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" :)).
Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: * "XWiki Flavor" * "Default XWiki Flavor" * "Generic XWiki Flavor" * "Base XWiki Flavor"
"Generic" is probably a way too technical term.
"Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me.
Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name.
WDYT ?
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
+0 for "Standard" (the definition is accurate but it definitively miss some sex-appeal) -1 for "Default" which is the opposite of sex-appeal. Vanilla might be a problem for users, but at least it was a cool name :) 2017-06-12 13:18 GMT+02:00 Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net>:
On 12 Jun 2017, at 12:42, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
"XWiki Vanilla", because it`s the *standard flavor* :D Sounds so funny that I kind of like it :)
However, I`m not so sure about non-techinical users or how that goes with other stuff that we already or might produce, since we don`t really have a pattern on that. Fun proposal, though.
My POV:
* The wikipedia page on “Vanilla” shows that the name is perfect from a technical POV. It really represents what we want. * I think most of our users are non-tech and wouldn’t understand it since I don’t think the “Vanilla” terminology is that common outside of tech circles
So I agree that it’s a fun proposal but we’ll get users asking us frequently why we chose an ice-cream flavor for an XWiki flavor ;)
Thus I’m also hesitating but I think I’m more -0 since “XWiki Vanilla" sounds more like a code name than a real name. I think that I still prefer “Standard” or “Default” ATM (with a small preference for “Standard” which has a bit more meaning than “Default” for me). Now if everyone else prefers “Vanilla”, I wouldn’t oppose it, as I also find it fun and to the point.
Thanks -Vincent
Thanks, Eduard
On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 8:07 PM, Marta Girdea <marta.girdea@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
I'm jumping in a bit late, but I was just wondering if anyone considered "Vanilla" [1]. It was the absolute first thing that popped to my mind when I saw the discussion about naming the standard flavour.
Just my 2 cents, Marta
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla_software
On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 7:07 AM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis and all,
On 10 Jun 2017, at 11:46, Denis Gervalle <dgl@softec.lu> wrote:
Hi All, Sorry to jump in after an already long discussion since we are getting close to a conclusion, so I just don’t want my intervention to cause more fuzz than good. I am in accordance with most of what was said so far, but “Default” looks to me a less valuable naming than “Standard”, it is not a strong opinion, so I give my +1 to “Standard” and +0 to “Default”. I will use “Standard" in the following, just to be clearer, but you can substitute it with “Default” if you wish (you might notice further subtle differences, or not). So, what I am not sure about now is why all proposals end with “XWiki flavor” (and this is not really about the American spelling of flavour ! :D). All flavours we gonna have surely will be XWiki ones, won’t it ? So if we start with the “Standard XWiki Flavor”, I am afraid we are going to lead a movement where everyone will name their flavour with that same suffix. Is that our intention ? “XWiki Standard Flavor” would already carry a different meaning, since it would say more “Standard flavour made by the XWiki team”. However, if our intent was more to say this is a generic wiki flavour, using “Standard Wiki Flavor” looks more in line with our intended meaning. And if our meaning is more that this is just a generic flavour, ending with “Standard Flavor” is probably simpler, clearer and better. WDYT ?
I agree with you.
I think we have 2 choices for the name that appears in the DW UI: * “Standard”. We may not even need the “Flavor” suffix in the same way as we don’t add an “Extension” suffix in the EM UI. IMO the DW UI for flavors should indicate the author in the UI, something like ”Standard” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team” or “developed by XWiki SAS” or “developed by Denis Gervalle”. * "XWiki Standard” or “XWiki Standard Flavor” to indicate it’s the one made by the XWiki open source dev team. So that could be the full name but the name we display in the DW UI could simply be “Standard Flavor” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team”, etc.
If we want to use the term “Wiki” then it could come as a replacement for the “Standard” term, to mention that it’s a generic wiki flavor, as opposed to an intranet flavor, a knowledge base flavor, etc. But I agree that “Wiki Flavor” is a good contender (and one that Ludovic mentioned too, he even mentioned Structured Wiki Flavor). I’d be +0 on “Wiki Flavor”. “Standard Wiki Flavor” is also possible and hints that there can be other generic Wiki flavors that are not standard. So I’m also +0 for it.
Now outside of the DW UI, the full name of the flavors done by the XWiki Dev Team could be prefixed with XWiki as in “the XWiki Standard Flavor” (or “XWiki Demo Flavor”). Other companies or individuals would name is with their identity, such as “the <my company> Procedure Flavor”.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 16:48, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote: So here is the current situation
= Proposition which don't annoy people enough to get a veto
* "Default XWiki Flavor" (+3) * "Standard XWiki Flavor" (+2)
= Someone gave a veto on those
* "Base XWiki Flavor" * "Classic XWiki Flavor" (good success for this one until it hits Edy and Vincent) * "Raw XWiki Flavor" * "Starter XWiki Flavor" * "XWiki Flavor” * "Generic XWiki Flavor"
Anyone want to change his votes ?
I don't really have a preference between "Default" and "Standard".
On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV:
* "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib.
Thanks -Vincent
> On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com
wrote:
> > Hi devs, > > I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform > flavor which is going to replace XE. > > Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now. > > As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied > to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" > :)). > > Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: > * "XWiki Flavor" > * "Default XWiki Flavor" > * "Generic XWiki Flavor" > * "Base XWiki Flavor" > > "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. > > "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. > Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's > fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed > extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. > > Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going > to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see > severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than > "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the > XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also > fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. > > WDYT ? > > -- > Thomas Mortagne
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
Question that I think should be answered first : what is the audience and the objectives ? On Mon, Jun 12, 2017 at 4:09 PM, Guillaume Delhumeau < guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com> wrote:
+0 for "Standard" (the definition is accurate but it definitively miss some sex-appeal) -1 for "Default" which is the opposite of sex-appeal.
Vanilla might be a problem for users, but at least it was a cool name :)
2017-06-12 13:18 GMT+02:00 Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net>:
On 12 Jun 2017, at 12:42, Eduard Moraru <enygma2002@gmail.com> wrote:
"XWiki Vanilla", because it`s the *standard flavor* :D Sounds so funny that I kind of like it :)
However, I`m not so sure about non-techinical users or how that goes
with
other stuff that we already or might produce, since we don`t really have a pattern on that. Fun proposal, though.
My POV:
* The wikipedia page on “Vanilla” shows that the name is perfect from a technical POV. It really represents what we want. * I think most of our users are non-tech and wouldn’t understand it since I don’t think the “Vanilla” terminology is that common outside of tech circles
So I agree that it’s a fun proposal but we’ll get users asking us frequently why we chose an ice-cream flavor for an XWiki flavor ;)
Thus I’m also hesitating but I think I’m more -0 since “XWiki Vanilla" sounds more like a code name than a real name. I think that I still prefer “Standard” or “Default” ATM (with a small preference for “Standard” which has a bit more meaning than “Default” for me). Now if everyone else prefers “Vanilla”, I wouldn’t oppose it, as I also find it fun and to the point.
Thanks -Vincent
Thanks, Eduard
On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 8:07 PM, Marta Girdea <marta.girdea@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi,
I'm jumping in a bit late, but I was just wondering if anyone considered "Vanilla" [1]. It was the absolute first thing that popped to my mind when I saw the discussion about naming the standard flavour.
Just my 2 cents, Marta
[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vanilla_software
On Sat, Jun 10, 2017 at 7:07 AM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote:
Hi Denis and all,
On 10 Jun 2017, at 11:46, Denis Gervalle <dgl@softec.lu> wrote:
Hi All, Sorry to jump in after an already long discussion since we are getting close to a conclusion, so I just don’t want my intervention to cause more fuzz than good. I am in accordance with most of what was said so far, but “Default” looks to me a less valuable naming than “Standard”, it is not a strong opinion, so I give my +1 to “Standard” and +0 to “Default”. I will use “Standard" in the following, just to be clearer, but you can substitute it with “Default” if you wish (you might notice further subtle differences, or not). So, what I am not sure about now is why all proposals end with “XWiki flavor” (and this is not really about the American spelling of flavour ! :D). All flavours we gonna have surely will be XWiki ones, won’t it ? So if we start with the “Standard XWiki Flavor”, I am afraid we are going to lead a movement where everyone will name their flavour with that same suffix. Is that our intention ? “XWiki Standard Flavor” would already carry a different meaning, since it would say more “Standard flavour made by the XWiki team”. However, if our intent was more to say this is a generic wiki flavour, using “Standard Wiki Flavor” looks more in line with our intended meaning. And if our meaning is more that this is just a generic flavour, ending with “Standard Flavor” is probably simpler, clearer and better. WDYT ?
I agree with you.
I think we have 2 choices for the name that appears in the DW UI: * “Standard”. We may not even need the “Flavor” suffix in the same way as we don’t add an “Extension” suffix in the EM UI. IMO the DW UI for flavors should indicate the author in the UI, something like ”Standard” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team” or “developed by XWiki SAS” or “developed by Denis Gervalle”. * "XWiki Standard” or “XWiki Standard Flavor” to indicate it’s the one made by the XWiki open source dev team. So that could be the full name but the name we display in the DW UI could simply be “Standard Flavor” and then “developed by XWiki Development Team”, etc.
If we want to use the term “Wiki” then it could come as a replacement for the “Standard” term, to mention that it’s a generic wiki flavor, as opposed to an intranet flavor, a knowledge base flavor, etc. But I agree that “Wiki Flavor” is a good contender (and one that Ludovic mentioned too, he even mentioned Structured Wiki Flavor). I’d be +0 on “Wiki Flavor”. “Standard Wiki Flavor” is also possible and hints that there can be other generic Wiki flavors that are not standard. So I’m also +0 for it.
Now outside of the DW UI, the full name of the flavors done by the XWiki Dev Team could be prefixed with XWiki as in “the XWiki Standard Flavor” (or “XWiki Demo Flavor”). Other companies or individuals would name is with their identity, such as “the <my company> Procedure Flavor”.
WDYT?
Thanks -Vincent
-- Denis Gervalle SOFTEC sa - CEO On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 16:48, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com> wrote: So here is the current situation
= Proposition which don't annoy people enough to get a veto
* "Default XWiki Flavor" (+3) * "Standard XWiki Flavor" (+2)
= Someone gave a veto on those
* "Base XWiki Flavor" * "Classic XWiki Flavor" (good success for this one until it hits Edy and Vincent) * "Raw XWiki Flavor" * "Starter XWiki Flavor" * "XWiki Flavor” * "Generic XWiki Flavor"
Anyone want to change his votes ?
I don't really have a preference between "Default" and "Standard".
On Fri, Jun 9, 2017 at 4:18 PM, Vincent Massol <vincent@massol.net> wrote: > So I’ve read this thread and here’s my POV: > > * "Base XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Thomas) > * “Classic XWiki Flavor” -1 (same reason as Edy, it means there’s a non classic and *better* one and we don’t have one so it doesn’t make sense) > * “Raw XWiki Flavor” -1 (not enough meaning IMO and a bit deprecatory) > * “Starter XWiki Flavor” -1 (would mean there’s another flavor which isn’t the case) > * "Default XWiki Flavor” +1 > * "Generic XWiki Flavor” +1 > * “Standard XWiki Flavor” +1 (makes the most sense IMO) > * "XWiki Flavor”. Here it’s hard to understand that “XWiki” actually means “developed by the XWiki project” and it would work only if other flavors don’t have “XWiki” in the name. This is why I’m -1 ATM for it. IMO it’s not easy enough to differentiate and understand what it means compared to other listed flavors such “Procedure Flavor” from XWiki SAS or “Demo Flavor” from contrib. > > Thanks > -Vincent > >> On 24 May 2017, at 11:51, Thomas Mortagne < thomas.mortagne@xwiki.com
wrote:
>> >> Hi devs, >> >> I'm getting closer to finish with the hard work around new platform >> flavor which is going to replace XE. >> >> Need to decide what user will see in the Flavor picker when installed XWiki now. >> >> As a reminder we decided that this would be a generic flavor, not tied >> to any specific use case (so forget about "Knwonledge Base Flavor" >> :)). >> >> Here is a few ideas gathered in previous mails: >> * "XWiki Flavor" >> * "Default XWiki Flavor" >> * "Generic XWiki Flavor" >> * "Base XWiki Flavor" >> >> "Generic" is probably a way too technical term. >> >> "Base" would be misleading IMO since it's not really a base flavor. >> Its primary goal is not to be used as a dependency (of course it's >> fine to have it as dependency if you just want to add pre installed >> extensions to the default flavor). It's a -1 for me. >> >> Frankly I would simply go for "XWiki Flavor". I know, it's not going >> to be the only flavor for XWiki but it's obvious when you actually see >> severals of those in the picker anyway and I find it nicer than >> "Default XWiki Flavor" which basically means the same thing since the >> XWiki core project does not plan to provide any other flavor. I'm also >> fine with "Default XWiki Favor" if others think it's a better name. >> >> WDYT ? >> >> -- >> Thomas Mortagne >
-- Thomas Mortagne
-- Guillaume Delhumeau (guillaume.delhumeau@xwiki.com) Research & Development Engineer at XWiki SAS Committer on the XWiki.org project
participants (10)
-
Denis Gervalle -
Ecaterina Moraru (Valica) -
Eduard Moraru -
Guillaume Delhumeau -
Marius Dumitru Florea -
Marta Girdea -
Olivier Seres -
Sergiu Dumitriu -
Thomas Mortagne -
Vincent Massol